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  1.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #1
    Sophomore Matt's Avatar

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    Community Tagging Overview

    Look at all the fun we're having.

  2. #2
    Let me preface this by saying I have experienced very little tag abuse so far, and am currently content enough with the tagging system. I understand why it exists, and enjoy the thoroughness the tagging system offers when searching. I think there's definitely room for improvement, so thank you for being open to suggestions!

    You touch on something that I think is at the heart of artists' concerns; creators retaining control of their work. The best suggestions will surround addressing this concern. Perhaps users should be allowed to opt out of community tagging, or tags have to go through an approval stage before being added. It's nice that we have the option to prevent others from removing our tags, but it doesn't feel like that's enough control when it comes to tagging. It still leaves us open to abuse, and takes preventative action out of our hands entirely. I personally would rather have the ability to approve or decline outside tags, instead of letting them be visible on my submission until I have the time to police my gallery's tags.

    These would be nice perks to have in the tagging system. Otherwise, keep up the great work!

  3. #3
    Senior Swanda's Avatar
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    - The system could really use some associated words feature; right now it doesn't even include both singular and plural of the same word for once. ("Cat" and "Cats" will give you completely different results)

    -As Eski mentions, a way for artists to approve tags before they are added.
    And of course an option to turn off "tag approval"

    - Hidden tags would also be a huuuge help in addition to that.
    They would be tags that wouldn't display on the submission for anyone but staff and the creator.
    These tags would be ignored by the search but would get picked up by the blocking filter.
    Tags not yet approved or discarded by the artist would be seen as hidden tags by the site.
    So if the tag is added by someone who is blocking it, the submission would disappear from their view instantly, while it wouldn't show up in searches, or appear on the submission to viewers.

    - Tags should be separated differently, no really get rid of the _ and allow me to copy paste a full sting please?
    Doing the:
    This is a tag, this is a different tag, three tag here,
    Appears to be pretty universal and make people less frustrated.

    - An “tags often used by you” list while submitting that you could just point and click to add the tag
    To speed things up a bit.
    Last edited by Swanda; 08-16-2015 at 08:46 PM.

  4. #4
    The option to block community tagging is sorely needed. I'm the only person I want tagging anything of mine.
    Sega does what Nintendon't.

  5. #5
    Hey, here are some random ideas:

    Create an interface for community taggers to easily tag a lot of works. Show them random artwork, allow them to tag it, maybe with suggestions based on already existing tags. Add a next button to go to the next random artwork.

    Auto-complete tags based on overall popularity (so you have less typos). Also you could add suggestions based on the description or other tags that are used on the image. Or suggest tags based on the previous works of the content creator or anyone mentioned in the description. So if I'm mentioned in the description, it'll suggest "snow leopard", because at lot of my artwork is tagged with that.

    Like Eskiworks said, add an optional approval system for the content creators.

    Add a number wang somewhere to the profile, add a point for an approved (and popular) tag, subtract 3 (or more) points for declined tags.

    Maybe don't show tags publicly until at least 2 people added (or confirmed) it to content to prevent abuse.

  6.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #6
    feline fine Noxid's Avatar
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    the most important part of the tag system to me is the ability to create a blacklist. There's some things out there that I just really would be happier not having to see on a daily basis. Being able to add my own tag to an image is an easy way right now for me to "fix" something that isn't tagged correctly without having to deal with the artist directly. So, I think this use case is something that should also be considered going forward.

    and yeah the other big issue with the tag system as it is now is that there are way too many aliases for the same "thing", like [cat] [cats] [feline] [kitty] [housecat], it goes on and on.

  7. #7
    Regular zenia's Avatar
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    While I appreciate it when someone thinks of a tag that I may not have (I do tag all of my work) I would like it if when someone wants to add a tag, it sends me a notification so that I can approve or reject said tag. I find it invasive to just automatically add tags without my (the creators) permission. Sure, I could remove it afterward... but I would prefer the choice to say 'yes' or 'no' beforehand.

    I mentioned this on a serial-taggers page several weeks ago. I had this problem on another website where people kept trying to tag one of my images as cub-porn... which it was absolutely not. I got at least 6 or 7 related tag suggestions and thankfully I was able to reject them all.

  8. #8
    If we're going to have useful tags, we need the community and consistent tagging standards. This means that we're going to have to go for a 'tag what you see' approach with standardized tags. This is just one of those things where a site can't give the artists 'whatever they want'. If we do that, we're just going to have tags become a useless mess as each artist will use their own opinion (rather than a community developed standard) to tag their work.

    As for some of the cases people have brought up, such as trans* work being tagged with 'futa', that could be solved with aliases. Simply replace 'futa' or 'herm' or such with a reasonable aliased name, and when someone searches for an aliased tag, bring up all of the aliases.

  9. #9
    Junior Webster's Avatar
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    I didn't even realize we didn't get asked for approval (unlike e.g. InkBunny). If that's actually the case then I'd say that's personally the biggest thing I'd like to see. The tags can even apply until you choose, but I definitely want to know when someone has changed a tag. Unless I get a notice I have no reason to go back to previous pieces to see if they've been changed.

    I disagree with Irbisgreif about requiring a "tag what you see" approach, but agree that standardized tags would be good. My suggested implementation would be that if an artist adds a tag that's not the "main representation" tag, it applies the main tag, too (e.g. cat -> feline), or at least suggests it. However, even if it doesn't add, just having search automatically handle it would be good, although perhaps not as efficient (computer resources wise) as just replacing the tag with its main (root) tag.

    I would suggest, if you do make an ontology/word-relation system to do that, that there would be a way to view relations, both in general and as new ones are added, so people can check them out and suggest additional relations, alternatives, or arguments against relations (e.g. someone says 'tiger' is just 'feline', but 'tiger' is a subset of it, so you shouldn't be replacing tiger, only adding feline to it.)

  10.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Eskiworks View Post
    Let me preface this by saying I have experienced very little tag abuse so far, and am currently content enough with the tagging system. I understand why it exists, and enjoy the thoroughness the tagging system offers when searching. I think there's definitely room for improvement, so thank you for being open to suggestions!

    You touch on something that I think is at the heart of artists' concerns; creators retaining control of their work. The best suggestions will surround addressing this concern. Perhaps users should be allowed to opt out of community tagging, or tags have to go through an approval stage before being added. It's nice that we have the option to prevent others from removing our tags, but it doesn't feel like that's enough control when it comes to tagging. It still leaves us open to abuse, and takes preventative action out of our hands entirely. I personally would rather have the ability to approve or decline outside tags, instead of letting them be visible on my submission until I have the time to police my gallery's tags.
    Just trying to understand your motivation here: while having suffered no abuse yourself, you're concerned about the potential for abuse? What kind of abuse are you anticipating that could be solved by having to approve all tag edits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Swanda View Post
    - Hidden tags would also be a huuuge help in addition to that.
    They would be tags that wouldn't display on the submission for anyone but staff and the creator.
    These tags would be ignored by the search but would get picked up by the blocking filter.
    Tags not yet approved or discarded by the artist would be seen as hidden tags by the site.
    So if the tag is added by someone who is blocking it, the submission would disappear from their view instantly, while it wouldn't show up in searches, or appear on the submission to viewers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kimura View Post
    Maybe don't show tags publicly until at least 2 people added (or confirmed) it to content to prevent abuse.
    This has come up several times in the past, but I still think it's a bad idea. We already get a lot of support requests saying basically "why can I see my post but my friend can't?" when the issue is the choice of maximum content rating. If submissions were silently filtered out without any user-visible explanation, that's horrible UX.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueJaySF View Post
    The option to block community tagging is sorely needed. I'm the only person I want tagging anything of mine.
    Can you explain why that is? I did just check, and it doesn't look like any submission of yours has gotten any tags added by anyone other than yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kimura View Post
    Create an interface for community taggers to easily tag a lot of works. Show them random artwork, allow them to tag it, maybe with suggestions based on already existing tags. Add a next button to go to the next random artwork.
    This is a great idea. Previously some people in dev had thrown around the idea of doing something like google's image categorization game, where two users are paired up and try to come up with new tags to add to an image that aren't in any of the existing tags. The trick is that they have to come up with the same descriptive words or phrases.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kimura View Post
    Auto-complete tags based on overall popularity (so you have less typos). Also you could add suggestions based on the description or other tags that are used on the image. Or suggest tags based on the previous works of the content creator or anyone mentioned in the description. So if I'm mentioned in the description, it'll suggest "snow leopard", because at lot of my artwork is tagged with that.
    Also good. I think dev has a proof-of-concept of this somewhere that never got polished to satisfaction.

    Quote Originally Posted by Webster View Post
    I didn't even realize we didn't get asked for approval (unlike e.g. InkBunny). If that's actually the case then I'd say that's personally the biggest thing I'd like to see. The tags can even apply until you choose, but I definitely want to know when someone has changed a tag. Unless I get a notice I have no reason to go back to previous pieces to see if they've been changed.
    You do get a notification on tag changes for a submission, but there's just no prompt of whether or not you want to approve it.

 

 

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