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  1. #61
    BlueJaySF, at this point what you're defending is basically on par with submitting porn and flagging it as General Audience, in terms of saying "fuck you" to people who don't want to see it. Hate to be so blunt about it, but I feel like I need to get across to you how others are going to perceive your position.

  2. #62
    I am not comfortable with other people being able to add tags to my uploads. I am more than capable of doing so myself, and if anyone feels I should add or remove a tag, then there's nothing stopping them from contacting me. If they have a valid reason that I find myself agreeing with, then perhaps I will add or remove suggested tags.

    I have no issue with the staff being able to moderate a submission's tags or its classification to prevent tag/upload abuse; I would be disappointed if they lacked the power to handle a situation so.

    But in terms of the general community being able to amateur-moderate my uploads? No. That's my place and no one else's.

    Draw as many comparisons as you desire in as blunt a manner as you choose to, you are far off the mark. I do not want faces in the crowd making personal adjustments to my uploads unless I have full involvement.
    Sega does what Nintendon't.

  3. #63
    Regular blufawx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by weykent View Post
    The incidence rate of people adding tags to be deliberately disruptive is very, very low. You had people do this on your submissions? Also, what does it mean if someone is adding tags "just to put tags in"? I would think that someone who is adding tags to your submissions is typically doing it with good intent.
    I wouldn't expect staff to not see anything wrong with the status quo. this attitude is exactly why I'm deleting my content up there now and asking any artists I commission, not to post the content on weasyl.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firehazard View Post
    BlueJaySF, at this point what you're defending is basically on par with submitting porn and flagging it as General Audience, in terms of saying "fuck you" to people who don't want to see it. Hate to be so blunt about it, but I feel like I need to get across to you how others are going to perceive your position.
    At this point, I have to agree with him. I'm the one that paid for that commission, or went to the artist and got the request free. No one else. If I'm uploading it on my internet connection that I pay for no one else should be tagging it uselessly.

    half the time when someone does tag something I've posted on weasyl, i've just gone in and deleted it anyway then blocked that user.

  4.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #64
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueJaySF View Post
    I am not comfortable with other people being able to add tags to my uploads. I am more than capable of doing so myself, and if anyone feels I should add or remove a tag, then there's nothing stopping them from contacting me. If they have a valid reason that I find myself agreeing with, then perhaps I will add or remove suggested tags.

    I have no issue with the staff being able to moderate a submission's tags or its classification to prevent tag/upload abuse; I would be disappointed if they lacked the power to handle a situation so.

    But in terms of the general community being able to amateur-moderate my uploads? No. That's my place and no one else's.

    Draw as many comparisons as you desire in as blunt a manner as you choose to, you are far off the mark. I do not want faces in the crowd making personal adjustments to my uploads unless I have full involvement.
    How about this: can you explain what it is that you lose by allowing community tagging? Both you and the community stand to gain from it: you get more exposure, and the community can find your submissions more easily.

    Quote Originally Posted by pthnrgrrl View Post
    I wouldn't expect staff to not see anything wrong with the status quo. this attitude is exactly why I'm deleting my content up there now and asking any artists I commission, not to post the content on weasyl.
    I'm more than willing to listen to people explain what it is that they wish to get out of disabling community tagging, as long as it's explained beyond "because I said so". There is a lot of FUD about tagging, which I'm trying to dispel while getting people to explain in more detail what it is that they really want. You are wrong about staff being content with the status quo; I've made multiple posts about how the staff have been thinking about changing the tag system. The news post itself even says: "This system is still in progress to its best state."

  5. #65
    Regular blufawx's Avatar
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    How about this: can you explain what it is that you lose by allowing community tagging? Both you and the community stand to gain from it: you get more exposure, and the community can find your submissions more easily.
    you also gain more trolling, less articulate tags, less control over your work/commission.

    communism didn't work in Russia either.

  6. #66
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    Regarding underscores vs. spaces, the one thing I highly suggest is having an option to auto-convert from one to the other. Additionally, being able to copy the tags after entering, as well as being able to paste tags when posting a submission, are really handy things. Currently I upload a submission to FA, Weasyl, and InkBunny at the same time. The great thing is I can copy and paste the title, description (minus link/icon/formatting changes), and tags from FA into Weasyl and InkBunny. It takes at most an extra couple of minutes to upload to all three vs. just one (and sometimes four, if I upload to DA, too). One of the things I do not like about SoFurry is I cannot paste the tags in, as it only uses spaces. InkBunny at least auto-converts.

    Secondly, I do think there needs to be a way to allow tags to be added. I have seen too many artists that refuse to use tags. If they don't want their work to be found, then why are they even posting their art online? Automatically blacklisting, or at least putting up a thumbnail with "untagged" by default (maybe the actual icon is blurred a bit, with the text on top?) I'm okay with, but I still really don't like the fact that artists can just leave works untagged. I try to tag my pictures as accurately as possible, and I welcome genuine feedback on it. I feel like there should be some middle ground between giving artists full control and doing something about artists that refuse to use tags or ignore older work.

    I think community removal of tags should require the artist to approve them, since on the whole they generally know what is accurate for a picture.

    Providing suggestions (for both spelling and alternatives, e.g. cat -> feline|house-cat) I think would be good to help create a consistent searching/browsing/blacklisting experience. Maybe suggestions for alternatives could appear below and the user could just click on it to add it to the list, and have an 'add all' button to easily accept all suggestions. This would minimize the amount of community tagging necessary to keep consistency. Another thing would be to have a list of common tag types (gender, weight, species, genitals, etc) to remind artists what to add. I know the reminders on another art site have helped me on occasion.

    As for community addition of tags, having an option to approve before use would be good, but doesn't help with accounts that artists don't pay attention to or abandon. Maybe having a timeout of some time, e.g. a month, after which if an artist hasn't approved/disapproved the tags, they get added automatically, and have the ability to report bad tags so if someone is adding bad tags to abandoned accounts they can be quickly reported and handled.

    I feel community tagging is greatly beneficial, but I have seen plenty of bone-headed decisions made about adding/removing tags from upload sites like e.g. e621 (including art of my own character), so I understand the hesitation of some folks. But throwing it out completely seems like a waste of a valuable resource (the community).

  7.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #67
    pixel-pusher Aden's Avatar
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    Here's a probably unfeasible idea: what about removing community tagging entirely, but upping the minimum amount of tags required to submit a piece? Double the amount? Triple it?

    Main problem with that is, the work would be quite well-described, but uploading would become so much more tedious. Community tagging was meant as a means to offload that burden from point-of-upload, but it comes with the control tradeoff.

  8.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #68
    Quote Originally Posted by pthnrgrrl View Post
    you also gain more trolling, less articulate tags, less control over your work/commission.
    re: trolling, that almost never happens. I asked if it happened to you, and you declined to comment?
    re: articulate tagging, that's not unique to community tagging, and there's a number of ontological things that can be done there which have been discussed in the thread.
    re: less control, tags are metadata. To this point, I'm curious: if any of your art goes up on, say, e621, do you feel the need to control the tags on those submissions too?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aden View Post
    Here's a probably unfeasible idea: what about removing community tagging entirely, but upping the minimum amount of tags required to submit a piece? Double the amount? Triple it?
    Even with the two-tag minimum, there's people who tag things just "as" "df" or "fuck" "tagging".

  9. #69
    How about this: can you explain what it is that you lose by allowing community tagging?
    I honestly don't feel that loss has anything to do with it.

    Both you and the community stand to gain from it: you get more exposure, and the community can find your submissions more easily.
    I tag my works as I feel is appropriate, and if someone thinks I missed something, again, they can speak to me and I will see whether or not it should be added or removed. There's nothing preventing someone from browsing my profile or folders for more of my uploads if one thing or another catches their eye.
    Sega does what Nintendon't.

  10. #70
    Regular blufawx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by weykent View Post
    re: trolling, that almost never happens. I asked if it happened to you, and you declined to comment?
    re: articulate tagging, that's not unique to community tagging, and there's a number of ontological things that can be done there which have been discussed in the thread.
    re: less control, tags are metadata. To this point, I'm curious: if any of your art goes up on, say, e621, do you feel the need to control the tags on those submissions too?
    Funny, I could have sworn I said I did have it happen to me. See what I mean by site staff? don't pay attention. Thus I've already made a picture for FA that says artists can't post my commissions to Weasyl.

    E621? If I see my stuff, commissioned or otherwise, up at that site I issue a take down notice. and I check twice daily for it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by XoPachi View Post
    Not that I expect it to be implemented.
    At this point I don't expect any ideas to be implemented and that this thread is for show only.

 

 

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