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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Pushing Boundaries

  1. #141
    Toshabi Pronouns Only Toshabi's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by s_p View Post
    There's nothing wrong with Sofurry.
    They've ruined the site with this, messy and oversized it ruins the whole experience of browsing weasyl and puts me off using the site.

    - - - Updated - - -



    No update at all is better then this crap.

    I think you're a loss /any/ website would benefit from.

  2.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #142
    Technical Staff Lagos's Avatar
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    Thanks for all the good feedback in the thread. =:)

    First of all, thank you to everyone who has come out to say they enjoy the new thumbnails. Seeing that our work has made people happy is what makes it worth it. And thank you as well to those who have explained why they *don't* like it. Especially those who have done so constructively, but even those who have done so, hm, with a fervent intensity.

    I'd like to enumerate everything that comes to mind as things I've heard for criticism here and elsewhere. This is off the cuff, so if I've forgotten or missed one, please feel free to add it.

    Layout and Sizes:
    • Some people find a grid view easier to navigate or cleaner.
    • Some people find the thumbnails just outright too big. Either because of bandwidth or because they want more things per page.
    • Characters have some issues with how they're displayed: It's inconsistent through the site, always boxed into squares and sometimes grids (enjoy, those of you who want grids)
    • Journals also have some display issue since their thumbnail is a 100x100 avatar and the text suffers. This is especially rough on mobile.
    • Legacy thumbnails are displayed slightly smaller than the 120x120 originals (around 110x110 from my testing, which doesn't sound like a lot but is actually about 15% smaller). This is a consequence of how we slightly tweak sizes programmatically to make the rows line up better. To me, this isn't that noticeable but I understand how some people might feel betrayed.
    • I hear there are some layout issues in Android 4.4? (Is that right/still true?)
    • The little ratings borders could benefit by being nudged a little.
    • Text submissions could probably use a different approach for thumbnails.
    • The new folder Old/New navigation has had mixed reviews: We wanted to make that more prominent because people were outright unaware of its existence in its old location. But some have found that it interrupts the flow of the submission page by separating the image from the owner's description and others have critiqued the white space.



    Social:
    • There's a concern that while now custom thumbnails are less necessary, an emergent result is that extreme imagery is more common while browsing whereas previously they would often be occluded.
    • Conversely, some people don't want custom thumbs on visual submissions at all.
    • Landscape orientations can get more space than portrait and people worry that this may be unfair or encourage people to make wide thumbnails.



    Some responses, just for my own view on these; this should be considered non-binding, my personal take, not a reflection of weasyl policy, etc. (Read: I just work on Weasyl, I don't speak for it).

    • On the grid view front, I recommend people try out Storm's CSS solution. Thanks, Storm, for writing that so quickly. I also, of course, recommend that you give the fluid rows a try for a week. =:)
    • If we change thumbnail sizes or geometry again it should be done in a way that permits different sizes for different people. That's a nice idea, but it'll be an architectural overhaul to do it well. Discussions on this are still preliminary.
    • Characters and journals could use some tweaks on their display. I'd prefer to fix the latter first because people being unable to read titles bothers me more than character display being janky for a bit.
    • On the extreme imagery front, what constitutes an unpleasant image for one person versus another is a social problem as much as a technological one, so I'd prefer to tackle this with better tagging and blacklisting support. Currently, our tagging culture isn't very good (thanks to those who do use the system though). We're talking about what can be done to improve tagging culture through features and policy to make that better, and where the right middle ground exists between giving artists control over their work and making a site that's navigable and searchable in a useful way for viewers (since after all, there's no point in hanging your work in an art gallery that no one can find).
    • A feature to disable custom thumbnails for visual submissions is currently in review.
    • I'd like to wait and see on the landscape issue to see if it becomes abused or a serious problem. Please don't troll this.
    Last edited by Lagos; 07-08-2015 at 04:02 PM. Reason: Better formatting.

  3. #143
    Senior Agitoho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedSavage View Post
    Generally if you're not trying to hide hard-alternative content then I don't mind it. In fact, sometimes its welcome, as is the case of people who create custom thumbnails that actually list off the content right there.


    General SFW and comic thumbnailing is generally fine imho.
    I'm actually starting to see an advantage of a, let's call it 'full picture thumbnail' at least as far as comics go. It becomes a lot more evident that 'this is comic page' then if you were to crop it and make it look like it's just another picture. And now that you can see the thumbnails better, it's hard not to take advantage of that. I'll probably still crop things to avoid spoilers, but now that I've had time to sit and think about it, I'm more warmed up to the idea of going default.
    No matter what happens, I will have always produced more visible work on my solo project than Ken Penders has on his in the last five years.

    I write and draw a manga. It's like a backwards comic. Give it shot, bro.

    "You can't just slap "& Knuckles" onto everything." & Knuckles

  4.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #144
    Sentimental Machine Fiz's Avatar

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    Polite reminder to cut out the insulting of others (and other websites for that matter) and to try to stay on topic.

    For those who don't like the update, just post polite criticism so we can utilize that feedback to perhaps adjust things. We all got our big boy/girl/etc. pants on, we can take it!

    For those who don't agree with people not liking the update, it's fine to discuss but there's no reason for it to get heated. We can all agree to disagree now and then, dontcha think?

    And just throwing out a thank you to those making stylish sheet options and to lagos for monitoring the thread for feedback.

  5. #145
    Sega does what Nintendon't.

  6. #146
    Regular UndyingSong's Avatar
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    Very nice post, Lagos! :3

  7. #147
    Junior Chri's Avatar
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    Looking good Weasyl =D
    Get your head out of the gutter. :p *She says with her head half way in*
    https://www.weasyl.com/~chri

  8. #148
    I signed up specifically just to make this post, as I didn't want to waste a journal entry or whatever on it. THANKS, OBAMA.

    Anywho.

    While I appreciate the third-party solution of the userstyle, that only provides a cosmetic fix to a foundational problem. CSS selectors alone can't fix what else happens behind the scenes—scripts, HTML, whatever—which is why I have a problem with the current state of the thumbnails system.

    I agree with all of the criticisms levelled against the new system so far, but one seems to have escaped the Woozilteam's eye: They didn't have a system in place that allowed us to choose a grid layout or a fluid layout. Of all places, DeviantArt lets people have the choice when browsing art on its various pages. (AFAIK, only the submission inbox lacks such a choice. Hint hint.) Woozilteam's shortsightedness in not offering users that choice has likely resulted in at least some of the complaints tossed their way, even if the complaining parties don't realize it.

    When you make a big change like this, ideally, you want to give users time to ease into the change—and, if at all possible, give them an option that “undoes” as much of the change as possible so their experience on the site doesn't feel disrupted. DA didn't (and still doesn't) force a fluid browsing layout on its users; Weasyl did. And while the majority of the userbase might like the layout, those that don't might feel marginalized by a decision that didn't seem to take their opinions into account.

    I appreciate Woozilteam for actually working on the site, addressing actual issues instead of mere cosmetic ones, and making the site feel like it hasn't gotten stuck in a quagmire of bullshit. (Not naming names. Everyone else does that, anyway. Everyone. Really.) But by forcing this change upon the userbase and refusing (whether by choice or by lack of forethought) to give users a choice between grid layout and fluid layout, I feel as though Woozilteam has…well…has fucked up kinda badly.

    Before anyone leaps in to say it: No, I'm not entitled to have the grid layout. (Hence the whole third-party cosmetic solution.) But I think Woozilteam should've at least thought far enough ahead to give people a choice to keep it.

  9. #149
    Dropping in to say, wow, it's good to see weasyl's most aggravating issue finally getting some attention.

    Custom thumbnails really should stay here. If I want to upload something weird that some people might not like, it gives me a space for some kind of content warning. Or if I'm posting a big comic or drawing progression all in one page, it would be really difficult for someone browsing to tell what it is without making my own thumbnail.

    People using misleading thumbnails for clickbaiting can just be reported/sent a generic warning message by the mods, or preferably the site could adopt an E621-style tagging system and just let people filter as they see fit. Bad tagging is something that really should be cracked down on for sites with adult content.

    As it is, the thumbnails seem to be a hair too big and a grid layout might be more appealing for a good number of people. Maybe they're about the right size on a better monitor?(using 1600x900 now). Seems like it should be possible to let people pick a size in their account settings if they're being scaled down and arranged dynamically by the page code.


    Another minor feature that I'd personally like to see implemented if time allows... blocking content by file extension. I can do this with adblock but it leaves big blank thumbnails that waste a ton of space.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by ijoe View Post
    blocking content by file extension.
    What? Why?

 

 

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