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  1. #1
    Junior Baxxter's Avatar
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    Diaper usage drawings and Weasyl guidelines

    I recently had some of my Weasyl commission submissions re-rated from Mature to Explicit due to depicted diaper usage. Here's an excerpt from the message I got from a Weasyl moderator:

    The following submissions were re-rated from Mature to Explicit, as the Ratings Guidelines state that "Any depictions of bodily waste must be rated as Explicit" [...] This rule applies to "messy diaper" pictures - including those where the presence of bodily waste is stated or implied.
    It does seem a bit strict and silly. There have been plenty of children's cartoons and comic strips depicting diaper usage through the years, for comedy and grossness reasons. And as a friend asked once I told him about the incident and quoted the guidelines: "So if they sneeze it's explicit?" So it does seem like relatively innocent pieces can end up getting an Explicit rating.

    As an example, here are two of my more non-graphic submissions, which are now rated Explicit:
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/169617
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/593521

    While I don't want to "cause a stink" (pardon the pun!), I figured it could be fruitful to start a discussion on the topic, hearing (or reading, rather) what other people think about this particular rule.
    "Sometimes the thing you think will cause you to lose friends and feel left out, can actually be the thing that helps you make your closest friends and realize how special you are."
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  2. #2
    Senior Gamedog's Avatar
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    Well it didn't say what it meant by "depictions". It's implied that these characters are shitting in their diapers and it's fetish material (IMO), so maybe that's why?
    I can't understand why it'd go into Explicit, however.. because like you said, this stuff has been around (fetish or non) for a long time, especially in cartoons.. it's just not intentional fetish material there.

  3. #3
    Senior Swanda's Avatar
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    I kinda have to agree that it is strict, especially when it's only implied c_c
    Might be a cultural thing? dunno, as someone who grew up with Bonbon-land candies, this seems silly.

    Here enjoy a NSFW Explicit+18 candy commercial form the 90's
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z--W9Cg3yJQ

  4. #4
    Senior Vae's Avatar
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    I personally don't have a problem with the rule that dirtied diapers should be put under the explicit filter, because I doubt this would even be up for question if an adult character were depicted soiling themself.

    That being said, there are no visible discolorations or fecal stains or anything in those two linked pictures that would even point to the act, had it not been lightly and cartoonishly alluded to.
    So I don't understand the decision to put those ones in explicit, either.
    Resident Koopa Trash

  5. #5
    Junior Baxxter's Avatar
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    Oooh, Bonbon! Used to love those candies. I rather miss them. Great (furry) artwork, fun concept. Denmark does seem to have a culture for being slightly more... explicit, though. I vaguely recall the Danish cartoon film Fuglekrigen showing both alcohol consumption and birds defecating. And I think that film was all ages, or at least not rated adults only.

    But potty humor and diaper usage is fairly normal in US cartoons and comics as well.

    For example this scene from Fairly Odd Parents (unfortunately rather poor quality, but still viewable), and this scene from Ren & Stimpy. Both fairly graphical, and both deemed kiddie safe. (Though I think there was some controversy around Ren & Stimpy back in the day, but I can't recall if it was just around the violence or also the gross-out stuff).

    There's also this classic Sabrina Online comic strip.

    All of these would be rated as Explicit by the current Weasyl guidelines.
    "Sometimes the thing you think will cause you to lose friends and feel left out, can actually be the thing that helps you make your closest friends and realize how special you are."
    ~ Twilight Sparkle

  6. #6
    Senior Kurk2288's Avatar
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    I didn't look at the artwork btw, due to my settings, but I'll assume it's like the examples- listed on here.

    This conversation, amuses me.
    I think it's a problem of subject vs portrayal, or maybe style?

    Cartoon depictions of violence are generally PG 13+, (Ha ha- funny stuff)
    Realistic depictions of violence are generally rated 18+, (oh shit, that's fucked up)

    Y'kno- you could just slap a leaf over it. DIAPER PROBLEM SOLVED.

    Edit: I think rating it mature would be enough? if it's as I imagine.
    Explicit seems a little extreme if it's just all in good humor, or whatever.
    Last edited by Kurk2288; 11-11-2014 at 10:36 AM.

  7.   This is the last staff post in this thread.   #7
    Didn't try, Succeeded Fay V's Avatar



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    Thanks for bringing the issue to our attention, the staff reviewed your complaint with the linked examples and agreed that the moderation on those pieces was too conservative for the purposes of Weasyl.

    The use of bodily fluids is generally used by staff to determine items being a more explicit nature than just what the mature rating would indicate. There are a myriad of reasons for this many of which can be summarized as this offers a more objective standard for us to determine sexual material versus material which is focused primarily on anatomy.

    That being said there is no wording within the CG or Ratings guide to say that "implied" bodily fluids in visual depictions should also indicate an explicit rating. The images you link imply the presence of bodily waste rather than the explicit presentation. We'll have a staff member go through and correct the mistake and make a note on the record that the previous rerate was overturned.

    We'll also continue to work on the ratings guide to make this more clear and come up with as close to a clear line as possible. For now the actual visual representation of bodily waste (urine, feces) or sexual fluids should be rated as explicit (including a visually messy diaper) but the implied use of implied body waste (fart jokes, etc.) may be rated as moderate.

  8. #8
    Junior Baxxter's Avatar
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    Hi Fay V, and thank you for interjecting! Good to hear you'll be looking over the rating policies again. It's definitely appreciated. It's tricky trying to write concise rules for these sorts of things.

    But to continue the discussion just a bit longer, as I'd be curious to hear more on what people think... There were four other pieces of mine which were also re-rated as Explicit. These are all more graphical and more in the gray area than the previous ones I linked to; here the diaper usage is less implied and less subtle.

    First, there are these two, both by the same artist:
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/419981
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/587075

    They are more graphic, but still fairly cartoonish, and not worse than either of the cartoon video clips I linked to.

    Then you have these two, which are even more graphic (be warned, if you easily react to these kinds of images you might want to skip these):
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/117749
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/587045

    These are more explicit, showing an older fur (ie. not a baby) in a soiled diaper, with discolouration. But should they be rated Explicit, with an 18+ age limit? They're not sexual, you don't see the feces per se, and they're not violent. But most might find them "a bit gross", which might be reason enough to mandate at least some sort of rating. I'm very unsure how to best rate pieces like these myself.
    "Sometimes the thing you think will cause you to lose friends and feel left out, can actually be the thing that helps you make your closest friends and realize how special you are."
    ~ Twilight Sparkle

  9. #9
    Senior Gamedog's Avatar
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    "For now the actual visual representation of bodily waste (urine, feces) or sexual fluids should be rated as explicit (including a visually messy diaper) "

    Just my opinion, I think the images linked are correctly rated

  10. #10
    Regular Storm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baxxter View Post
    First, there are these two, both by the same artist:
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/419981
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/587075

    Then you have these two, which are even more graphic (be warned, if you easily react to these kinds of images you might want to skip these):
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/117749
    https://www.weasyl.com/submission/587045
    In my opinion, the point of the ratings is, apart from legal reasons, that people won't see things that are more than they can handle. Diaper usage is something that many people would rate as hardcore, and I think someone who doesn't want to see sex scenes usually also doesn't want to see things like this.

    The question isn't really how much it fits certain words written in a document, or that if it's sexual or not, but rather how disturbing it can be for general public.

    Without being judgmental, I believe that a great number of people who are fine with some nudity or light implications buit don't want to see "explicit" stuff would feel sick from bumping into the last two. Even for me, while I have some ties to diaper fetish and can enjoy pictures depicting wetting, looking at the last two made my stomach turn. So we must be thoughtful of that something can hit the nerves of sensitive people without being nearly sexual. Even for wetting pictures, that I just said I enjoy in several cases, I would put under Explicit.

    My personal opinion is that the second two 100% belong in Explicit, the first two are kind of an edge case but I personally would say they are better in Explicit than in Mature.
    - Storm ~ "Sic itur ad astra per aspera." [Commission info]

 

 

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