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  1. #61
    Premium User QT Melon's Avatar


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    Quote Originally Posted by Fay V View Post
    Elementary is a parasitic reboot. Making Watson female in and of itself is not a problem, but doing it for the sake of digging at sexual tension basically cuts out the characterization as a whole. What was once a complex relationship of foils is reduced to a "will they, won't they" string.
    Reminds me of the Bechel and Russo tests http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bechdel_test

    It annoys me to no end that it has to be about a sexual relationship if it's a man/woman (though LGBT is coming in more). I think what has been bothering me is that for the longest time Lucy Liu is the "go to Asian woman" like there aren't many others out there that could have been capable.

    If older Black and Latin/Hispanic Women are rare, I think older Asian women are a near extinct species in Hollywood.

    I never felt Fantastic Four presented themselves as a Superhero family well, hopefully they get it right.

  2. #62
    Regular Tica's Avatar
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    all these comics have been going on since like the 60s. there is no "original character" to moan about in many of these cases because they've been redone, reinvented, and retconned enough in the comics themselves.

    basically, this doesn't bother me one jot. then again, I'm not a huge fantastic four fan. I think Sue Storm is an awful character often written in a heavy-handed, misogynist way, and nothing about the story really interested me ever. I don't care enough to even try and see the movie and usually I'm a big superhero movie fan.

    I also didn't watch Elementary... I have friends who love it to pieces and I respect their opinions on it. I just don't happen to like crime-drama-style shows. But I wouldn't call it a "parasitic reboot" I'd call it a "creative reimagining". Especially for stuff that's been in the public domain for ages, you can have fun with that shit. Like Pride and Prejudice with Zombies. it's just part of our cultural imagination. Personally I love reimaginings, like modern-day Shakespeares for example. It's fun. And the source material still exists... if you don't like the reimagining, just go back to your comic books or the other whitey movies and binge on those and leave the new stuff alone *shrug*

  3. #63
    Premium User QT Melon's Avatar


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    Ok, so question here, you're alright with them swapping one problem for another? Does it need to be romantic? Fay didn't complain about the fact that there's a female Watson, it's not creative if they push it into what can be deemed as fanfic territory by substituting it for Romance. It is in the end a disservice to gender equality.

  4. #64
    Senior Damian's Avatar
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    The only reason they changed genders for watson is because of america being homophobic and uncomfortable with bromance undertones. Of course i said this before but fuck readin, right guys?

    Also can someone please explain how changing a character's race or sex but not their personality is creative. Imo, that's less creative than Sonic recolors because the person at least has a bit of difference in personality (and name)
    Last edited by Damian; 03-01-2014 at 03:57 PM.
    We all have our demons. If we're not fighting them, then we've befriended them.

  5.   This is the last staff post in this thread.   #65
    Didn't try, Succeeded Fay V's Avatar



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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleu View Post
    The only reason they changed genders for watson is because of america being homophobic and uncomfortable with bromance undertones. Of course i said this before but fuck readin, right guys?

    Also can someone please explain how changing a character's race or sex but not their personality is creative. Imo, that's less creative than Sonic recolors because the person at least has a bit of difference in personality (and name)

    Well that's the point. They wanted to get at the romance angle, and they couldn't do that with two guys for an american audience. It's not really even addressing the source material, just the people going "lol they were totally gay for each other". Even if it was a male Watson and they went with the super bromance "they're totally gay for each other" route the story would be awful, because it's dumbing down the story.

    Just doing color or gender swaps isn't creative. It's patronizing. It's just people going "fuck this will keep them quiet" with no effort put in.

  6. #66
    Premium User QT Melon's Avatar


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    Last edited by QT Melon; 03-01-2014 at 04:59 PM.

  7. #67
    Senior Damian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fay V View Post
    Well that's the point. They wanted to get at the romance angle, and they couldn't do that with two guys for an american audience. It's not really even addressing the source material, just the people going "lol they were totally gay for each other". Even if it was a male Watson and they went with the super bromance "they're totally gay for each other" route the story would be awful, because it's dumbing down the story.

    Just doing color or gender swaps isn't creative. It's patronizing. It's just people going "fuck this will keep them quiet" with no effort put in.
    I know it was mainly addressed to Tica who had mentioned that Elementary is "a "creative reimagining". There is literally nothing creative about having Watson being played as a female. If the producers or whoever is in charge wanted "creative reimagining" then they should at least go all out with it like they did with House.

    Others include:
    The Lion King
    The Lion King 2
    West Side Story
    A Bug's Life

    and a couple others that I can't think of right now because I'm tired as hell.

    Blah blah point is that there's nothing creative about gender-bending or race-swapping. To me it's just shoe-horning and pandering while saying "LOOK HOW PROGRESSIVE WE ARE"

    @QT
    I dunno, it's kinda hard to make The Thing look...not stupid http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Th...1_coverart.jpg

    The superhero movies now just seem so subpar compared to before, aside from the Avengers (and I surprisingly liked Thor given that...I don't care for Thor).

    I swear to god they better NOT fuck up Deadpool. I SWEAR TO GOD
    We all have our demons. If we're not fighting them, then we've befriended them.

  8. #68
    Premium User QT Melon's Avatar


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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleu View Post
    I swear to god they better NOT fuck up Deadpool. I SWEAR TO GOD
    You did see the Wolverine movie? It already happened.

    I think it is possible to make the Thing look more interesting. If you saw the Guardians of the Galaxy Trailer Groot actually looks pretty cool


  9. #69
    Senior Damian's Avatar
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    I know but in this article talking about the Deadpool movie, they said that they're not going to acknowledge not-Deadpool from the Wolverine movie.
    We all have our demons. If we're not fighting them, then we've befriended them.

  10. #70
    Regular Tica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QT Melon View Post
    Ok, so question here, you're alright with them swapping one problem for another? Does it need to be romantic? Fay didn't complain about the fact that there's a female Watson, it's not creative if they push it into what can be deemed as fanfic territory by substituting it for Romance. It is in the end a disservice to gender equality.
    is it romantic, tho'? if it is, then gross. I hate when shows fall back on that old, tired trope.

    however, from what I've heard from the first season, there's not a romance angle between them? I already said I don't watch it though. I1ve only read in-depth reviews of a handful of eps.

    just for the record, I'm not calling Elemetary good or even a good example of a "creative reimagining". Just an example where people got upset for bullshit reasons... since yeah, there's already been like ten million "faithful" Sherlock adaptations; the existence of one that isn't doesn't erase the ones that are.

    If you don't like it 'cause it's a bad show, that's fine. I already said I don't particularly like that genre myself.

 

 

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