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  1. #51
    Regular benanderson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RogueSareth View Post
    The term is from the 90's, the community itself was built upon The Silver Elves who were most active in the early 70's.
    Again, refrencing Orion sandstorms Otherkin Timeline http://orion.kitsunet.net/time.pdf
    Middle English Dictionary, 1981:
    "Otherkin: a different or an additional kind of, other kinds of"
    The 1990 Usenet group was not the first use of Otherkin to describe something of a different kind, because Otherkin was already defined as such a decade prior - probably even longer ago than that.

    Also, I sped-read it - if you want to show people that otherkin are not stark raving lunatics, don't show them that document because Jesus H. Geiger.
    Dysphoria is now my word of the day after reading a few pages of that. Some bits were hillarious because of their ludicrusness, some bits were actually terrifying (in reference to mental wellbeing).

    All that document did was show me that Otherkin is nothing more than Dysphoria wrapped up in a Pseudo-Religion that has been made up as it goes along. First it was people who identified AS elves, nothing about reincarnating, they just were elves. Then fantasy nerds got into the mix and you all of a sudden have orcs, elves, dragons and so forth. Add the introduction of the furry fandom in the late 80s and early 90s and all of a sudden people are claiming to be everything from a Door Mouse to Cathulu.

    The sheer lack of any coherent logic is mind boggling.

    Quick Question, what made you get up one morning and go "oh hey, I must be part cat" ? Do you just like cats? Did you decide to draw a fursona one day and go "I like the cat design, I must be a cat since this design was meant to be an alternative representation of me", or was it litterally a moment where you woke up and just said "I was a cat in another life"? Honest to god question I'm asking here.

  2. #52
    Toshabi Pronouns Only Toshabi's Avatar

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    After watching several hours of pokemon, I've come to terms that I really was a pikachu in one of my previous lives.

  3. #53
    Senior Aakosir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RogueSareth View Post
    ^ while the vast majority of otherkin I have encountered over the years are perfectly normal, hardworking people with familes, jobs, ect ect, every so often you get that ONE idiot, who can't stop talking about the EPIC astral war hes fighting every day, and hows hes so oppressed for being other and blah blah blah.

    On most forums that one idiot gets banned eventually, but its that ONE that is the most vocal, the most visable to people outside the community, especially now with Tumblr.
    I actually have a friend who believes she saved an alternate universe from some evil creature. Who is to say it's not true? Unless there is physical evidence that something does not exist I am not going to discredit them. Science cannot explain everything. I find those who think therians are mentally ill incredibly shallow and close minded. There are many things that cannot be explained by science.

    And to answer benanderson's question. It actually took me years to come up with my belief. I would say about 4 or more. I have always felt connected to snow leopards in a different sort of way and not just "oh, I really like this animal". Yes, I believe in reincarnation so the possibility that I was once a snow leopard is very real to me. If you believe in souls they are very old creations. To think that souls just fade away and die? That is beyond me. Also spending an eternity in an afterlife? That's unfathomable. The earth recycles everything, so why wouldn't the universe recycle souls?
    Last edited by Aakosir; 02-21-2013 at 01:03 PM. Reason: typo

  4. #54
    Toshabi Pronouns Only Toshabi's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aakosir View Post
    I actually have a friend who believes she saved an alternate universe from some evil creature. Who is to say it's not true? Unless there is physical evidence that something does not exist I am not going to discredit them. Science cannot explain everything. I find those who think therians are mentally ill incredibly shallow and close minded.
    ......


    I believe your friend is mistaking a dream/drug induced fantasy from reality. Your line of thinking, the very thing you base your belief on.... it can all be easily turned against you. We might as well release anyone who hear voices in their head from the looney bin under the basis and assumption that the voices they hear might be real since we "can't disprove it". Or the very inane idea that people who truly believe that they are a pokemon trapped in a humans body aren't crazy since we truly don't know if such beings exist in another universe?

    The whole concept of therian beliefs and ideals sounds like someone wishing their fan fictions and fantasies to be true by deluding themselves with the idea that they are true because "anything is possible". Your post (particularly this part) made my thoughts on the very subject that much more concrete.

  5. #55
    Premium User Unburnt Daenerys's Avatar
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    Eh, they seem pretty harmless to me. I'm a materialistic atheist, but I prefer to save my rage for religions that harbor serial child rapists or try to force their beliefs on everyone. Therianism/otherkin seems to be more benign, so I don't think comparing it to harmful shit like homeopathy is correct.

    That being said, if you go around telling people that your ~true form~ is that of a hermaphrodite wolf-dragon with six tits, don't start bitching when people side eye you.

  6. #56
    Regular RogueSareth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benanderson View Post
    Middle English Dictionary, 1981:
    "Otherkin: a different or an additional kind of, other kinds of"
    The 1990 Usenet group was not the first use of Otherkin to describe something of a different kind, because Otherkin was already defined as such a decade prior - probably even longer ago than that.

    Also, I sped-read it - if you want to show people that otherkin are not stark raving lunatics, don't show them that document because Jesus H. Geiger.
    Dysphoria is now my word of the day after reading a few pages of that. Some bits were hillarious because of their ludicrusness, some bits were actually terrifying (in reference to mental wellbeing).

    All that document did was show me that Otherkin is nothing more than Dysphoria wrapped up in a Pseudo-Religion that has been made up as it goes along. First it was people who identified AS elves, nothing about reincarnating, they just were elves. Then fantasy nerds got into the mix and you all of a sudden have orcs, elves, dragons and so forth. Add the introduction of the furry fandom in the late 80s and early 90s and all of a sudden people are claiming to be everything from a Door Mouse to Cathulu.

    The sheer lack of any coherent logic is mind boggling.

    Quick Question, what made you get up one morning and go "oh hey, I must be part cat" ? Do you just like cats? Did you decide to draw a fursona one day and go "I like the cat design, I must be a cat since this design was meant to be an alternative representation of me", or was it litterally a moment where you woke up and just said "I was a cat in another life"? Honest to god question I'm asking here.

    Oh, interesting, I did not know that. every piece of info I've gotten from the older members of the community have pegged it to the 90's.
    well, I'll say I got the wrong info on that anyways.


    My kintype is humanoid, it has nothing to do with my fursona or me being a furry.
    The first time I considerd being nonhuman in some way or another, I did not have the internet, in fact it would be another three years until I had ANY access to a computer or the internet to find a community based around it.
    I just believe, and always have, in reincarnation and the possibility of having lived a past life as something not human.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toshabi View Post
    ......


    I believe your friend is mistaking a dream/drug induced fantasy from reality. Your line of thinking, the very thing you base your belief on.... it can all be easily turned against you. We might as well release anyone who hear voices in their head from the looney bin under the basis and assumption that the voices they hear might be real since we "can't disprove it". Or the very inane idea that people who truly believe that they are a pokemon trapped in a humans body aren't crazy since we truly don't know if such beings exist in another universe?

    The whole concept of therian beliefs and ideals sounds like someone wishing their fan fictions and fantasies to be true by deluding themselves with the idea that they are true because "anything is possible". Your post (particularly this part) made my thoughts on the very subject that much more concrete.
    She has never done drugs so that theory isn't even considerable. I don't know what her thought process was. And mental illnesses can and are provable. They are caused by chemical imbalanced in the brain which are very easy to prove. There is a HUGE different between being mentally ill and believing in spirits.

    So then I am guessing you are atheist because no one can prove religion. No one can prove that there are gods or spirits. If their belief is not harming anyone then why are they being judged so? It's this type of hypocrisy from furries that I cannot stand. Almost everyone has to have another group to make fun of and demean so they can feel better about themselves, simple human psychology. So what are your skeletons in your closet that you have to irrationally compare belief (which have been around for centuries) to metal illness (which are completely unrelated to beliefs)?

  8. #58
    Toshabi Pronouns Only Toshabi's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aakosir View Post
    She has never done drugs so that theory isn't even considerable. I don't know what her thought process was. And mental illnesses can and are provable. They are caused by chemical imbalanced in the brain which are very easy to prove. There is a HUGE different between being mentally ill and believing in spirits.

    So then I am guessing you are atheist because no one can prove religion. No one can prove that there are gods or spirits. If their belief is not harming anyone then why are they being judged so? It's this type of hypocrisy from furries that I cannot stand. Almost everyone has to have another group to make fun of and demean so they can feel better about themselves, simple human psychology. So what are your skeletons in your closet that you have to irrationally compare belief (which have been around for centuries) to metal illness (which are completely unrelated to beliefs)?

    Otherkin have been around since the 90s. Your "belief" was formed /by yourself four years ago/. If a member of my family believed that they were an animal or can shoot rainbow's out of their ass to fly to other imaginary universes to save them from a catastrophic evil, I believe the right thing to do is to get them help rather than to let their delusion control them. Encouraging such thinking from made up beliefs that you create (as stated by yourself), how can you not see the problem with that? And don't scape goat other religions with your bizarre beliefs, because at least their basis for belief is based on history and not from "well, I just made it up from being in the furry fandom, lolz".



    Let's not forget the fact that your beliefs and those that share it only commune together online. There's a reason for that.

  9. #59
    Regular RogueSareth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toshabi View Post
    Otherkin have been around since the 90s. Your "belief" was formed /by yourself four years ago/. If a member of my family believed that they were an animal or can shoot rainbow's out of their ass to fly to other imaginary universes to save them from a catastrophic evil, I believe the right thing to do is to get them help rather than to let their delusion control them. Encouraging such thinking from made up beliefs that you create (as stated by yourself), how can you not see the problem with that? And don't scape goat other religions with your bizarre beliefs, because at least their basis for belief is based on history and not from "well, I just made it up from being in the furry fandom, lolz".



    Let's not forget the fact that your beliefs and those that share it only commune together online. There's a reason for that.
    A fair ammount of otherkin and therians have seen mental health professionals and have been told by said professionals that as long as their beliefs are not interfering with their ability to function in everyday life and are not cause harm to themselves or others, theres no reason to think its a mental illness. Otherwise ALL religions and spiritual beliefs would be considered a mental illness.

    And as Akasoir said, mental illness is provable, and yes, some otherkin have a mental illness, some link their kinness to that, some have their beliefs despite the illness, but a good number of us DO NOT have a mental illness and believe what they believe anyways.

    Again, the ONLINE otherkin community has existed since the 90's, but the community is based off of the writings and experiences of the Silver Elves from them 70's and the general gist of the belief has similarities or basis in beliefs thousands of years old.


    Like I stated in a previous responce, I have always believed in spirits and reincarnation. since before I can remember, and despite obvious lack of proof and thinking about it, and reasoning for YEARS, I still believe it.

  10. #60
    Senior Aakosir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toshabi View Post
    Otherkin have been around since the 90s. Your "belief" was formed /by yourself four years ago/. If a member of my family believed that they were an animal or can shoot rainbow's out of their ass to fly to other imaginary universes to save them from a catastrophic evil, I believe the right thing to do is to get them help rather than to let their delusion control them. Encouraging such thinking from made up beliefs that you create (as stated by yourself), how can you not see the problem with that? And don't scape goat other religions with your bizarre beliefs, because at least their basis for belief is based on history and not from "well, I just made it up from being in the furry fandom, lolz".



    Let's not forget the fact that your beliefs and those that share it only commune together online. There's a reason for that.
    How do you know ancient cultures have not had similar beliefs (Nevermind, I can answer that one myself)? Many have animal gods and totems. Egyptian, Mayan, Aztec and all the Native American tribes have strong beliefs about animal spirits. Tribes in Africa too. Many cultures believe that their gods came to them in forms of animals and that animals are sacred. India anyone? Rats, cows and Indian elephants are sacred. Along with the monkeys which run wild in their towns. Eagles were sacred in ancient Greece, along with peacocks, bulls and owls to name a few. All twelve animals of the Eastern Zodiac are sacred. Why? Because they are symbols of gods and/or the god themself inhabiting said animal. Some beliefs vary slightly, but this is the overall belief. The dove is one of the most sacred animals in Christianity and Cothalicism because it represents God!

    You really need to do a lot more research before you approach a subject which someone is passionate about. Seriously. You should go look in to some more ancient cultures and then come back to this debate. You are seriously lacking in the history department.

    And the reason we commune online? Because it is much easier to get in touch with people who have similar beliefs. Why are you on furry forums? For the same. exact. reason. It is much, much easier to find furries online than in your own town. That argument was pretty weak. Although all of your arguments have since you lack facts to back up your side. You have no argument other than trying to compare spirituality to mental illness. Which is a very, very weak argument.

 

 

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