Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 30
  1. #11
    Senior foxboyprower's Avatar
    Weasyl
    foxboyprower
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Boring center of the USA
    Posts
    104
    Ah. I has just heard a rumor that minors were not allowed to sign up at all. At least that stifles that rumor I heard. That was my main concern.

    - - - Updated - - -

    That's a good point since Cub art is very well established there.

  2. #12
    Premium User Temrin's Avatar

    Weasyl
    Temrin
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts
    167
    If you hear a rumor, it is good to do your own research and not believe everything you hear from others. There are nay sayers about Weasyl who have been spreading random things without any actual backup about it. So :/

  3. #13
    I'd like for the site to allow cub porn sometime in the far future, I don't think it's really fair to exclude it and for some idiots people to leave a site because EW CUB when there are equally disturbing fetish materials on the same site but people will always act stupid and without rationale.

    As for now, this is an issue I cared deeply about, and still do, so I asked Taw to elaborate in a PM. I'll just post the contents of that PM in here:
    Quote Originally Posted by Taw
    I'll shed some light into this as best I can from my knowledge for you, but please understand that the following is my personal opinion on the matter and drawing off knowledge that I believe is accurate, though I would need to double check to be absolutely certain.

    Back in September, Kihari was making development posts on FA about Fergal, an art gallery he was attempting to create, which was supposed to be an alternative to FA - one that is more secure (other people's private messages on the mainsite are impossible to leak or view without root access and that is secure and only two or three people have access to 'em, for example!) and more efficient with coding. About a week after he started posting about it, I offered to help out in the form of doing some graphics and a small amount of web design for him, as well as get some things set up and working such as forum software.

    He agreed and the two of us slowly developed some aspects of Fergal, and then in January we gathered a team together, and then brought in Aden to do the front-end of the site, since my knowledge of html and css isn't that strong (which has definitely improved quite a bit this past year!).

    We were fairly open to ideas and suggestions from the fellow staff, and we collaborated on many different aspects of the site. Then when we got to the Community Guidelines drafting and what we can and can't allow on the site, we had to research laws and look into it more.

    We're trying to make something that isn't a money pit like FA seems to be (Dragoneer pays out of his pocket, several thousand I believe, per month for it or something!) and try and make Weasyl self-sustainable with the form of premium membership.

    Looking into it more, we found the laws on drawn child porn were quite.. iffy. I know cub porn isn't quite exactly drawn child porn, and that it's fantasy work (since it is anthropomorphic creatures and such!), but it was a really gray area.

    We inquired with quite a few payment processors (though not many would even allow drawn porn, so that limited us to only a few!) for our premium membership for transactions since Paypal would destroy us if we tried to use them (we may have a payment processor though that accepts paypal, though we're still working on the details of which one to go with, etc, so don't take that for sure!).

    All of them essentially said if we were to allow that kind of material, they'd shut us down right away, and the fees for these aren't cheap either. It's $750 or so a year for a payment processor for visa and mastercard I believe!

    On top of this, several of our staff members have jobs that require background checks, and some are in the government sector in their countries, which would look extremely bad to have on their record and could actually land them in trouble, depending on how the court looks at it (since this is all a massive legal gray area and nothing is 100% for sure or certain!).

    We had a vote and the staff came to the consensus that for the best interests of Weasyl and it's staff, we'd need to disallow cub porn on the site.

    Personally, it's not my thing at all, but I'm not going to tell people that it's gross or wrong or anything - different strokes for different folks and all. I believe no one should be judged for what their interests behind closed doors are. Though we just can't really see Weasyl being sustainable and keeping around a lot of our staff members if we allowed it.

    I hope this clears things up a bit for you. I know it's annoying that something is disallowed, yet we can allow things like feral porn, which is essentially drawn bestiality, but the laws for that differ depending on the state you're in and it's not as iffy as cub porn is.
    Last edited by Taw; 10-28-2012 at 05:14 PM.
    If you say "plz" because it's shorter than "please," I'll say "no" because it's shorter than "yes."

  4. #14
    Retired Staff Tiger's Avatar
    Weasyl
    Tiger
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Michigan
    Gender
    grrl
    Posts
    1,287
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazekai View Post
    I'd like for the site to allow cub porn sometime in the far future, I don't think it's really fair to exclude it and for some idiots people to leave a site because EW CUB when there are equally disturbing fetish materials on the same site but people will always act stupid and without rationale.
    There was a thread a while ago about cub porn and the staff said it was not allowed. Taw just reiterated the fact that it is not allowed. I'm sure other people share your view that it is unfair that many other fetishes on the site are allowed while cub porn is banned, and you have a right to be unhappy about that. But just because some people are unhappy doesn't mean Weasyl can jeopardize being sustainable by allowing cub porn to be submitted. You just need to accept the fact that there won't be cub porn on Weasyl.

    And everyone is entitled to their own fetishes or lack of them. It doesn't make them "stupid" or "wrong". It's not "irrational" that someone is uncomfortable about the subject of an artwork and chooses not to be involved in a community that hosts that kind of work. They have a right to dislike a fetish just as much as you have the right to enjoy a fetish.
    Last edited by Tiger; 10-28-2012 at 06:17 PM.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiger View Post
    There was a thread a while ago about cub porn and the staff said it was not allowed. Taw just reiterated the fact that it is not allowed. I'm sure other people share your view that it is unfair that many other fetishes on the site are allowed while cub porn is banned, and you have a right to be unhappy about that. But just because some people are unhappy doesn't mean Weasyl can jeopardize being sustainable by allowing cub porn to be submitted. You just need to accept the fact that there won't be cub porn on Weasyl.

    And everyone is entitled to their own fetishes or lack of them. It doesn't make them "stupid" or "wrong". It's not "irrational" that someone is uncomfortable about the subject of an artwork and chooses not to be involved in a community that hosts that kind of work. They have a right to dislike a fetish just as much as you have the right to enjoy a fetish.
    I pretty much quoted what Taw said for the sake of clearing it up, while still maintaining that I do not fully agree with it but won't hold it against them since it's out of their control.

    By "far future" I meant in a few years, possibly when it becomes a trivial political subject that nobody finds offensive anymore in the same way that people do not find other things offensive.

    A lot of things make people uncomfortable. Gay porn makes people uncomfortable, scat makes me uncomfortable, nobody bans those because it is uncomfortable for some people. If anyone's reasoning for why it shouldn't be allowed is purely because it makes them uncomfortable, and if any website did allow it, I'd tell them to suck it up and use the tag filters like big boys and girls. If that sounds rude, I don't care. I'm sick of the argument that people avoid inkbunny because it allows porn they can easily block and I just view those people as a bunch of crybabies.

    And just to reiterate: I know it's not allowed for legal reasons, I accept that it's not allowed for legal reasons, but that doesn't mean I'm going to stop discouraging people looking down their nose at it for other reasons.

    Edit: And I'm talking about the userbase, not the admins. I do not want this site's community to develop an elitist anti-cub attitude just because it's not allowed, I want to discourage that as much as possible, because if that becomes prominent in the community, I will leave. I don't want to deal with that, I get enough pointless crap from people over my fetishes already and I simply won't feel safe here if that happens.

    That's why I keep popping up in threads where this is an issue. I want to do something that would make this not like FA where people spit on you just for having an IB account even if you aren't breaking the no cub porn rule, I want to feel as welcome as any other person and I'm sure I'm not the only one. This is a thread about making the site more appealing to more people, right? One of the ways that can be done is to not have a community that cultivates hate or shunning for people just because of the porn they look at, and I'm genuinely afraid that's what this rule will do.

    Edit2: I know the rule can't be changed but I hope something else can be done for us, I'm trying to get involved and fight for my cause but I don't have the authority required to formally protect myself or people like me if the site ends up harboring that kind of attitude and it becomes commonplace.
    Last edited by Kazekai; 10-29-2012 at 08:26 AM.
    If you say "plz" because it's shorter than "please," I'll say "no" because it's shorter than "yes."

  6. #16
    Retired Staff Tiger's Avatar
    Weasyl
    Tiger
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Michigan
    Gender
    grrl
    Posts
    1,287
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazekai View Post
    I pretty much quoted what Taw said for the sake of clearing it up, while still maintaining that I do not fully agree with it but won't hold it against them since it's out of their control.

    By "far future" I meant in a few years, possibly when it becomes a trivial political subject that nobody finds offensive anymore in the same way that people do not find other things offensive.
    You're essentially expecting people to change the law. And even if it was legal, you're expecting that webhosts/servers change their views on it. I just don't see it happening. There are other sites that cater to cub porn, so I'd recommend that anyone who wants to see/draw cub porn go to those sites instead of ranting about Weasyl not having it- which, by the way, no one here is specifically "looking down" on cub porn.

    A lot of things make people uncomfortable. Gay porn makes people uncomfortable, scat makes me uncomfortable, nobody bans those because it is uncomfortable for some people. If anyone's reasoning for why it shouldn't be allowed is purely because it makes them uncomfortable, and if any website did allow it, I'd tell them to suck it up and use the tag filters like big boys and girls. If that sounds rude, I don't care. I'm sick of the argument that people avoid inkbunny because it allows porn they can easily block and I just view those people as a bunch of crybabies.
    My thought is that some people may view cub porn as a parallel for child porn, and Weasyl is probably not going to be able to change that. Also, people have the right to not post on a site that allows content that they are against. For example, someone might want to join Weasyl but does not like the furry fandom (for whatever reason it may be) and chooses not to post there. They should not be looked down on because of that. It's important to respect the fact that people have different opinions you do and that because they act on their opinions does not give you the right to be inconsiderate to them.

    And just to reiterate: I know it's not allowed for legal reasons, I accept that it's not allowed for legal reasons, but that doesn't mean I'm going to stop discouraging people looking down their nose at it for other reasons.
    Just let it go. Weasyl is not going to allow cub porn and no degree of discouraging will be able to change that.


    ---------------------------------

    EDIT: Show me five examples on either the forum or the mainsite where there have been anti-cub "elitists". I personally, on this forum, cannot think of even three examples of people degrading cub porn. Maybe there are some remarks about it on the mainsite, but I haven't seen any. I do not see any hints at the community becoming anti-cub. I do not see anyone "spitting" at pro-cub people for being on InkBunny. And this isn't fA, either, so it can't really be compared to this one.

    It's almost like you're taking offense at comments people haven't even made. I understand that you feel very strongly about the cub porn policy, and you have a right to not agree with the policy. But just because it's there then there doesn't mean there are a ton of anti-cubs on the site. Unless, as I said, anti-cubs are causing a real, legitimate issue that might even need the Weasyl staff to look into it.
    Last edited by Tiger; 10-29-2012 at 09:09 AM.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiger View Post
    You're essentially expecting people to change the law. And even if it was legal, you're expecting that webhosts/servers change their views on it. I just don't see it happening. There are other sites that cater to cub porn, so I'd recommend that anyone who wants to see/draw cub porn go to those sites instead of ranting about Weasyl not having it- which, by the way, no one here is specifically "looking down" on cub porn.



    My thought is that some people may view cub porn as a parallel for child porn, and Weasyl is probably not going to be able to change that. Also, people have the right to not post on a site that allows content that they are against. For example, someone might want to join Weasyl but does not like the furry fandom (for whatever reason it may be) and chooses not to post there. They should not be looked down on because of that. It's important to respect the fact that people have different opinions you do and that because they act on their opinions does not give you the right to be inconsiderate to them.



    Just let it go. Weasyl is not going to allow cub porn and no degree of discouraging will be able to change that.


    ---------------------------------

    EDIT: Show me five examples on either the forum or the mainsite where there have been anti-cub "elitists". I personally, on this forum, cannot think of even three examples of people degrading cub porn. Maybe there are some remarks about it on the mainsite, but I haven't seen any. I do not see any hints at the community becoming anti-cub. I do not see anyone "spitting" at pro-cub people for being on InkBunny. And this isn't fA, either, so it can't really be compared to this one.

    It's almost like you're taking offense at comments people haven't even made. I understand that you feel very strongly about the cub porn policy, and you have a right to not agree with the policy. But just because it's there then there doesn't mean there are a ton of anti-cubs on the site. Unless, as I said, anti-cubs are causing a real, legitimate issue that might even need the Weasyl staff to look into it.
    I don't know if you've ever really seen the kind of backlash that I have about the subject, but since you asked, I will show you an example on the forums. It's a bit old, and I hope this doesn't start a fight, but I can oblige this. http://forums.weasyl.com/vbulletin/s...ull=1#post4844

    I don't think it's reasonable to expect that someone be respected for believing cub porn is equal to child porn, because that's basically calling everyone who looks at it a pedophile. You wouldn't accept homophobia or transphobia, you shouldn't accept any unfair or hateful bias people have, period. Think about how that makes the person being negatively judged feel, are their concerns about where they feel welcome not important to you?

    I know this is one incident, one incident on one site. I've been to many. I won't go into detail about this, but I have experienced the kind of hate that I would like to not happen here. Maybe it won't. For now, the majority seems to be neutral, but I don't know if that will last.

    Also, it is legal to look at in the US, I'm not sure about Canada.

    Edit: That link I posted is exactly the kind of crap I don't want to become commonplace. Maybe you don't think it's a big deal because you aren't in the direct path of it and it isn't your problem, but it's a problem for those of us who are effected.
    Last edited by Kazekai; 10-29-2012 at 10:05 AM.
    If you say "plz" because it's shorter than "please," I'll say "no" because it's shorter than "yes."

  8. #18
    I am HEAVILY against cub porn showing up on this site. Just because it is a 'fantasy' does not make it any less disturbing to viewers. What people are forgetting is that furs are somewhat more accustomed to babyfur pornography than the rest of the world. I can guarantee that babyfur will do nothing but drive people /away./ If people want places for cubporn they can just go to Inkbunny. Period.
    Also, I believe FA banned cubporn because, if they did not, paypal would no longer do business with them nor anybody from there. And I am honestly relieved, because while not everybody who looks at cub pornography is into little kids, I guarantee you somebody out there is. It is also an incredibly sensitive subject nobody can just 'get over and accept as fantasy.' I have witnessed horrid images of child rape fantasies and what not and it would instantly kill this site if shown up here.
    Several people view inkbunny as just a 'furry cub porn website where they all flock.' They all need to stay there where they are happy, there is no need to bring them here and have great discomfort among the rest of us. By making that small group of people 'happy' a far bigger number of people will be severally bothered and perhaps even LEAVE here. So while, yes, nothing should be spat upon and nobody has the right to hate on somebody because of their fetish....it should not be forced on others either. 'Furry' erotica is one thing since it is just so broad....Child pornography, no matter how fantasy base, is a huge no from me. Especially if you want to keep paypal happy.

    I want to make it clear I have no issues with cub furs. I am not looking to start a fight, but I am voicing my opinion that I strongly disagree with cubporn being here.

  9. #19
    Senior PapayaShark's Avatar
    Weasyl
    PapayaShark
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    213
    If the site allowed cub porn, a lot of pedophiles would join(don't lie and say that people who likes the idea of children having sex isn't at least a bit pedophile).And when the site also allows minors on it becomes a problem. Not saying all pedophiles groom children, but the risk increases greatly. If web sites that doesn't have porn on them have a problem with grooming, sites that allow child porn will have a massive problem with it.

  10. #20
    Why should we even debate the attitudes towards cub porn? So what if people start acting elitist about it? It's not going to change the status of the cub porn rule. I also think no one would even discuss or go on a tirade about it if people didn't keep bringing up cub. It's a non-issue, it's not something that's going to appear on the site, I just don't see the point in debating how ethically unfair it is when we pointed out that it's a legal issue.

 

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •